Unsure of the performance, I started with the stock antenna. The desktop clients have MSI PC60G Turbo G PCI cards with external omni stock atenna's, Laptop clients: 1 ASUS card and a Buffalo Airstation card.
The router is located in a wooden open air tiki hut as shown, approximately 12 feet above ground.
I approximated 4 days to complete the job.....it's been 12 days.
Coverage is poor everywhere except the immediate vicinity of the tiki hut.
I've tried a 7 dbi d-link omni antenna attached directly to the router (no cable).
I've tried a Hawking amplifier set at 100 mW.
I've tried directional antennas at the clients.
I've tried several height positions and orientations within the tiki hut.
I've tried changing the power output from 10 to 84 to 15 to 75 to 60.......boardflags set to 0x2.....etc etc..
After the WHR-HP-54G began to connect disconnect connect disconnect connect disconnect...over and over and over every other second ....because there was obviously something wrong with the HP....(never had the amp activated with power over 10 mW), I flashed it several times with V23.1 to no avail then switched to Tomato and had the same problems...
I replaced it with a WHR-G54S.....and I am still having problems with range.
I tried setting up the first Buffalo WHR-HP-54G with WDS, but again....connect disconnect connect disconnect connect disconnect...over and over and over every other second......
So I need some advice here.....I've been scouring the forum for a month now....the last 12 days have been hell!
How can I achieve my goal?
What would you suggest?
I'm ready to get rid of all my equipment and start over with an appropriate design....
You have the router way to high, It should be around the same height as the adapter. This is even more important if you use a high gain omni like the d-link.
I have experiment by placing the router and inverted antenna below the second level of the tiki hut, at approximately 6 feet. But its no better then any of the other positions......
And this was in the Wiki:
How can I increase range outdoors?
The most important thing for making your signal go far outside is height! The higher in the building you position your radio the further its signal will travel. Even a standard indoor unit with standard antennas can be used from 600 m (1,968 feet) away! To go farther you need to start using better antennas, the Access Point would work well with a 7 dB mounted just above roof height, this will give you a good 600 m (1,968 feet) to 1500 m (4,921 feet), it goes further in open areas and less far in built up areas. It's important to match the gain and height of your antenna to how far away you wish to receive your signal. You may end up picking up signals that you would be better off not being able to see. Also the use of too much height with a 12 dB antenna would mean your signal does not really come back to ground level for several kilometers past where you wish to use it. The effect of this is that it seems your signal is weak and does not go very far. This is an illusion: The signal could be going way over your head. A lesser gain antenna at a lower height would yield a far stronger local signal and immunity for interference from far away stray signals.
Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 12 Location: Mannheim, D
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 1:37 Post subject:
Trevor wrote:
You have the router way to high, It should be around the same height as the adapter. This is even more important if you use a high gain omni like the d-link.
Joined: 06 Jun 2006 Posts: 3763 Location: I'm the one on the plate.
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:45 Post subject:
Did you clear the NVram after flashing to the various firmwares ? That is usually a critical requirement, and failing to do so would easily explain the squirley connect/disconnect cycles of the HP. Also, it has been proven that exceeding the default values for MW in the HP model will destroy the unit, as will connecting it to a hawking amp while having the HP pre-amp enabled. The hawking amp also has a pre-amp, and using it with the HP model with it's pre-amp enabled will render the access point inoperable, and will damage the electronics in the access point. The regular buffalo should be destroy proof by use with the hawking. If I were you, I would flash the regular buffalo back to stock firmware, after which do a hard NVram clear by holding the reset button down for 45 seconds with the power on, continue holding the reset, dis-connect power for 10 seconds and re-connect power while still holding the reset button for another 30 seconds. This will ensure that the unit is back to factory settings. Then hook it to the hawking amp. Set the hawking for 250 Mw or 500 Mw. Even with the rubber duck on the hawking you will achive a solid 1,200 foot range and high connection rates with the antenna 15 feet above ground level. I use several hawkings in similar setups. They are awesome ! Your longest hop of 300 feet is child's play with the gear you have. The stock HP right out of the box would have been over-kill for your setup. _________________ http://69.175.13.131:8015 Streaming Week-End Disco. Station Ripper V 1.1 will do.
I'm starting to see some light at the end of this tunnel.....
Last night I flashed both Buffalo's with v.24 to take advantage of the repeater function. I set up the HP as the host with the stock antenna and placed the G54S with stock antenna inside of the garage to cover that area and the house to the left. I did not have a chance to see if the signal from the repeater made it into the house, but I was able to connect to the repeater from my laptop and browse the net. Oddly, it was extremely difficult to log into the repeater while surfing was fine.....
I added the 7 dbi Antenna to the host and watched the signal with Netstumbler.....it got worse....I have to pass that off as poor placement since I should theoretically get a stronger signal.....right?
I will try the solution suggested by GeeTek, thank you. I can always use the HP as a repeater.....I would like to take advantage of the hardware I have and anything that will improve range is exciting for me.....
When you say stock firmware are you referring to the original Buffalo firmware? Or just default setup for the firmware I am running. And if you are suggesting to revert to the original firmware, please explain why.
also, you say open tiki hut, so i'm wondering if you're in a very warm, humid place? if so the signal will by nature degrade more quickly. since noise and signal decay seem to be an intrinsic problem for you i would suggest you concentrate on reception before you pursue transmission.
Something like that could help immensely, and is relatively cheap. (That particular panel is 43.00, ive seen them as low as 19.00 usd via google/froogle)
i understand the benefiets of an omni directional antenna in your case, and cannot deny that it would be the ideal solution. if signal must originate from the tiki hut you might consider purchasing a high gain omni directional, and using it with a wrt54gl @ ~140mW without the hawkings. (less noise)
here are two ways you might make directional antennas work. i believe my spreads are around fifteen degrees (give or take five, it was freehand), but lots of directional panel antennas go up to 25 degrees.
the transmission to point F in the second picture is left out, you would need to either repeat signal with another directional antenna to F, or run ethernet cable. whichever is more cost/performance effective for you.
Joined: 06 Jun 2006 Posts: 3763 Location: I'm the one on the plate.
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 20:05 Post subject:
The stock firmware is the buffalo original. I suggested this to be sure that you were not having config or nvram corruption issues, both of which are of moderately high probability. As johhny primus points out, you should check the back ground noise level at the hut as compared to the received signal level of the laptop when at the various targeted coverage points. The pre-amp in the Hawking amplifier will generate about 1/2 Db of noise, similar to the amount generated by the HP pre-amp. As long as the RX signal is 2 Db or more above the background noise level, the tiny amount of noise (1/2 Db or less) generated by the pre-amp is not a detrimental factor, leaving the pre-amp as a beneficial tool in establishing a reliable link ( Do not use both pre-amps, as I mentioned before). Trees can be a huge limitation for your range. I just noticed the trees on your diagram. How thick is your foliage ? Also, repeater mode is still somewhat experimental, and adds a good deal of un-neccessary complexity to the system. WDS repeater would be a lot simpler and more functional for your setup. If you are having blockage problems from the foliage, you can chain WDS repeaters serially for 4 or 5 hops before degrading the speed from a typical broad band internet source. WDS and the V24 repeater both will halve the bandwidth (not speed) with each hop in your link path. When your source bandwidth exceeds the link bandwidth, your speeds will drop to match the value of the delivered bandwidth. _________________ http://69.175.13.131:8015 Streaming Week-End Disco. Station Ripper V 1.1 will do.
I loaded the original firmware into the buffalo WHR-G54S and attached the Hawking with the 7 dBi antenna. I set the hawking to 200 mW.....
using net stumbler I walked toward the garage....the signal progressively got worse as I approached the garage and was totally lost inside the garage.... I left the laptop in the garage and switched the hawking to 500 mW....went to the garage and still had no signal.
As I walked, with the laptop, back to the tiki hut, I could not get the signal back..even with direct line of sight...I had to remove the hawking and hook up the stock antenna. Even then I had difficulties acquiring an ip address....3 feet from the router.....5 feet.....12 feet....so I rebooted the router and got the signal back.
As I am sitting here 4 feet from the router, netstumbler shows -68 dBm S/N.......
2 minutes later, -30 dBm S/N
I hooked up the Hawking again, this time with the stock Buffalo antenna and set it to 200mW.....slight increase to -33 dB/m S/N.
8 feet and on the same horizontal plane as the antenna, -40 dBm
50 feet and about 20 degrees below the antenna, -65 dBm
85 feet outside building F still with line of sight, -70 dBm
Southwest corner of building C, -70 dBm
Between C and D, -50 dbm
North side of B, -70 dbm
East side of A, -60 dBm
How are these numbers?
I don't know how to determine the background noise here...
In regards to the foliage.....I have clear line of site to the roof of the garage and part of building B.
I am really hating this project. I'm thinking of picking up a a new router.....just to rule out the Buffalo's as the problem.....
Joined: 06 Jun 2006 Posts: 3763 Location: I'm the one on the plate.
Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 22:29 Post subject:
Your latest readings with the hawking and stock buffalo sounded closer to realistic. It sounds like you are having some serious hardware problems. The 7 Db antenna is obviously bad. Another possability is that you have the wrong kind of antemnna. The Buffalo and the Hawking use RP-SMA. It is easy to accidentally buy an antenna with a regular SMA connector, and that would leave you with no connecting center pin, and basically no connection to the antenna. If that is the case, it would damage the amplifier and radio to transmit with no antenna, and this could also explain why you still have poorer than expected signal. Also, the hawking came in 2 variations, having differences in the connector types and polarities. The antenna jumper cables that came with them should be correct. Double check all of your antennas, cables and antenna connectors to be sure that you have an appropriate coupling of type and gender. Depending on the performance of the laptop, your last readings could be fairly close to expected with the stock antenna and 200 Mw from the hawking. I would have expected more signal strengths though. What kind of wi-fi adaptor is in the laptop ? _________________ http://69.175.13.131:8015 Streaming Week-End Disco. Station Ripper V 1.1 will do.
minimally you ought to borrow a router from someone else and try again. this sounds like bad hardware. i'd suspect faulty router(s) before the amps, but i suppose you cant rule anything out.
Some serious hardware problems makes a lot of sense.....
I checked the connectors on the antennas and cables.....everything was kosher...
I have an Atheros internal adapter in my laptop and I routinely switch over to a Buffalo card to check for differences.....
Not knowing anyone else with a router, and since I used my personal router already in this situation, I picked up a wrt54g on sale. I set up WDS with the Buffalo WHR-54G in the garage. It was very difficult to connect the two with WDS in the first place. I switched from v.24 to v.23 SP2 to get them to communicate while next to each other.....but when placing it in the garage, no dice....I again tried different placements and antenna configurations. Unfortunately, I left the site pissed off again....no progress.
Today I decided to pick up an identical wrt54g to replace the Buffalo in the garage.....effectively eliminating any Buffalo products from my system. Set up WDS and got very excited as streaming video was now possible in the garage! Ping times to the host are about a tenth of a millisecond! I hope to verify connection inside building B tomorrow.
So it was definitely a hardware issue....and its really sad that I had simply followed the wiki's and several warnings about antenna settings, and now I have two loser Buffalo routers....
I am using the stock antennas on the wrt's, but ordered some 7 dBi rubber ducks from Sharper Concepts. I also got a few 5 dBi range extender omni's to replace the little rubber ducks that came with the PCI adapters. I had second thoughts about them, thinking I should have got some planel's, but I may not need them.
So thats where I am today, feeling better about this project. Thanks for you help guys!
*12ft = 56 feet dead zone, but...
