be AWARE of using any FON related TRADEMARKS here

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BrainSlayer
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Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 6103
Location: Dresden, Germany

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:29    Post subject: be AWARE of using any FON related TRADEMARKS here Reply with quote
read the letter i received today
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kyros
DD-WRT Novice


Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:16    Post subject: Reply with quote
Dear BrainSlayer,

some months ago I had a similar expierience with FON Germany.
At this time i was supporting the FON Community (not FON company!) with graphics to implement in FON related websites and programm GUIs.

I always published a copyright info like this:
    Copyright information:
    Termes of use from my side

    If you use these graphics to publish it somehow please insert the following text beneath them: Design concept (c) 2006 (later 2007) by kyros<AT>hariri.at free for private FON community users. All Logo rights belongs to FON.

    From my side everyone in the FON community can feel free to use these drafts for their private FON projects (linus-behaviour @ FON). If FON likes to use the whole or parts of this or someone else uses it for business purposes please let's talk about this before (bill-behaviour @ FON).

    For the usage of FON graphics please read in detail and take care about the applicable FON legal notice at http://en.fon.com/info/legal/.

They blamed me for claiming copyright on FON graphics which is obvoiusely not true (each child can read it above).
Anyway the threatened me with trial if I wouldn't drop all copyrights (so they could use my graphics for free), but I refused and removed all FON Logos.
We in the inofficial German speaking FON Community decided to show independence and so and I created own Logos for our www.fonboard.de and our developers site www.freewlan.info which offers a enhanced La Fonera GUI based addon.

As information for you here the Link to the EU Trade mark consultation service ( http://oami.europa.eu/CTMOnline/RequestManager/en_DetailCTM_NoReg ) which shows you searching for "FON" exactly what is protected in relationship to FON:
  1. The Name FON (protected)
  2. The "fon" Logo (protection process not completed)
  3. The name Fonera (protection process not completed)
So think you are not allowed to use the name FON for your products and to use the orange "fon" Logo displayed there for your publication (web and programs).
But in my opinion it is possible to use the word as decription for the company. And as I found the Name Lafonera isn't protected... Wink

In my opinion if you just erase all FON logos out your pulications and do not title any of your products with FON or Fonera it's done. But I think you can create an own Name and describe for what products your software can be used...
And I think they cannot prohibit the production of a better firmware for their product and the other things they tired to force you in this letter.
But better ask a lawyer to confirm about this.
If you want I can create a logo for you and your DD-WRT application which you produce for the La Fonera.

Best regards from sunny Vienna,
Kyros
BrainSlayer
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 6103
Location: Dresden, Germany

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:20    Post subject: Reply with quote
as you see we wont use any fon logo here and we do not use the fonera name in one of our products. so i come to the conclusion that fon wants to stop the whole fonera firmware project here.
_________________
one cigarette costs 2 minutes of your life.
one bottle of beer costs 4 minutes of your life.
one working day costs 8 hours of your life.

DD-WRT supported Concerts @ Bunker Dresden
03.10.2014 - Front 242 / Haujobb / Planet Myer Day
kyros
DD-WRT Novice


Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:33    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yes - perhaps they are more pissed off because your and their history with the first FON router's firmware (Linksys WRT54GL). Last october they changed to La Fonera to cut off the better DD-WRT firmware they couldn't influence anymore.
So now they are in the same (funny) position as half a year ago Laughing .

But I think the cannot prohibit that you offer a better firmware for their weak product's GUI - they can just prohibit the usage of above described protected trademarks. The routers are not their property anymore -> the La Foneras belongs to the users. And in my eyes it's their decision what to do with their owned device.

Here FON is stangely different minded. The update the users device without asking owners. Information just comes some weeks afterwards. So now a lot of users disable this feature.

Regards, Kyros
BrainSlayer
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 6103
Location: Dresden, Germany

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:38    Post subject: Reply with quote
and there might be also another good reason why FON does now start to take actions against anyone who uses the FON name on a website.

someone told me that FON is one the way to get sold, so they are searching for a investor and FON's isnt much worth without the name

_________________
one cigarette costs 2 minutes of your life.
one bottle of beer costs 4 minutes of your life.
one working day costs 8 hours of your life.

DD-WRT supported Concerts @ Bunker Dresden
03.10.2014 - Front 242 / Haujobb / Planet Myer Day
kyros
DD-WRT Novice


Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:44    Post subject: Reply with quote
Right - and this can be the reason, too why they enhance censorship in their coorporate English board. The picture they draw for the investor should be as virginal as possible...

But if the investor can use google this pink painting will fail.
Embarassed Kyros


Last edited by kyros on Mon Apr 30, 2007 13:03; edited 1 time in total
BrainSlayer
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 6103
Location: Dresden, Germany

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 13:02    Post subject: Reply with quote
we will see. we are checking the conditions for germany right now. from my point of view this is just childish and a case for the newspapers
_________________
one cigarette costs 2 minutes of your life.
one bottle of beer costs 4 minutes of your life.
one working day costs 8 hours of your life.

DD-WRT supported Concerts @ Bunker Dresden
03.10.2014 - Front 242 / Haujobb / Planet Myer Day
fpage77
DD-WRT Novice


Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 29
Location: Raleigh, NC

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 17:42    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hey Brainslayer there is a FON logo on the wiki that you might want to get rid of so they don't harrass you. http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/La_Fonera
BrainSlayer
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 6103
Location: Dresden, Germany

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 17:49    Post subject: Reply with quote
refresh your browser cache. i removed this logo some hours ago. so there is just the fonera picture left with the dd-wrt label on it
_________________
one cigarette costs 2 minutes of your life.
one bottle of beer costs 4 minutes of your life.
one working day costs 8 hours of your life.

DD-WRT supported Concerts @ Bunker Dresden
03.10.2014 - Front 242 / Haujobb / Planet Myer Day
fpage77
DD-WRT Novice


Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 29
Location: Raleigh, NC

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 18:03    Post subject: Reply with quote
I see now you removed it. I had no idea I was cached.
t3chman
DD-WRT Novice


Joined: 18 Mar 2007
Posts: 39
Location: Alabama, USA

PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 2:37    Post subject: Reply with quote
It might even be advisable to remove the FON logo from the scanned letter in this post... Just a thought.
kyros
DD-WRT Novice


Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 9:17    Post subject: Reply with quote
No - it's not. You're just showing a FON letter with it's logo - original as it is.
Here you don't use the Fon logo to titel your own product.
But maybe you're kidding?

Rolling Eyes Kyros
BrainSlayer
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 6103
Location: Dresden, Germany

PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 10:22    Post subject: Reply with quote
its a official letter to me and is original as it is. fon had always the chance to talk with me in a friendly way. but this case here is discusting and needs to be published
_________________
one cigarette costs 2 minutes of your life.
one bottle of beer costs 4 minutes of your life.
one working day costs 8 hours of your life.

DD-WRT supported Concerts @ Bunker Dresden
03.10.2014 - Front 242 / Haujobb / Planet Myer Day
BrainSlayer
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Jun 2006
Posts: 6103
Location: Dresden, Germany

PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 11:19    Post subject: Reply with quote
kyros wrote:
Dear BrainSlayer,

some months ago I had a similar expierience with FON Germany.
At this time i was supporting the FON Community (not FON company!) with graphics to implement in FON related websites and programm GUIs.

I always published a copyright info like this:
    Copyright information:
    Termes of use from my side

    If you use these graphics to publish it somehow please insert the following text beneath them: Design concept (c) 2006 (later 2007) by kyros<AT>hariri.at free for private FON community users. All Logo rights belongs to FON.

    From my side everyone in the FON community can feel free to use these drafts for their private FON projects (linus-behaviour @ FON). If FON likes to use the whole or parts of this or someone else uses it for business purposes please let's talk about this before (bill-behaviour @ FON).

    For the usage of FON graphics please read in detail and take care about the applicable FON legal notice at http://en.fon.com/info/legal/.

They blamed me for claiming copyright on FON graphics which is obvoiusely not true (each child can read it above).
Anyway the threatened me with trial if I wouldn't drop all copyrights (so they could use my graphics for free), but I refused and removed all FON Logos.
We in the inofficial German speaking FON Community decided to show independence and so and I created own Logos for our www.fonboard.de and our developers site www.freewlan.info which offers a enhanced La Fonera GUI based addon.

As information for you here the Link to the EU Trade mark consultation service ( http://oami.europa.eu/CTMOnline/RequestManager/en_DetailCTM_NoReg ) which shows you searching for "FON" exactly what is protected in relationship to FON:
  1. The Name FON (protected)
  2. The "fon" Logo (protection process not completed)
  3. The name Fonera (protection process not completed)
So think you are not allowed to use the name FON for your products and to use the orange "fon" Logo displayed there for your publication (web and programs).
But in my opinion it is possible to use the word as decription for the company. And as I found the Name Lafonera isn't protected... Wink

In my opinion if you just erase all FON logos out your pulications and do not title any of your products with FON or Fonera it's done. But I think you can create an own Name and describe for what products your software can be used...
And I think they cannot prohibit the production of a better firmware for their product and the other things they tired to force you in this letter.
But better ask a lawyer to confirm about this.
If you want I can create a logo for you and your DD-WRT application which you produce for the La Fonera.

Best regards from sunny Vienna,
Kyros


just as information. the word FON was denied as trademark in germany since it was a common word for Telefon
i check your link too and it show clearly that FON isnt protected yet. its still in ground check phase
as you see the phase was just changed yesterday. so it seems that it is rechecked right now

Absolute grounds check 30/04/2007
Application published 12/02/2007
Application accepted 06/10/2006
Absolute grounds check 06/10/2006
Formalities OK 06/10/2006
Formalities pending 06/10/2006
Classification OK 06/10/2006
Filing Date accorded 02/10/2006
Application received 28/09/2006

_________________
one cigarette costs 2 minutes of your life.
one bottle of beer costs 4 minutes of your life.
one working day costs 8 hours of your life.

DD-WRT supported Concerts @ Bunker Dresden
03.10.2014 - Front 242 / Haujobb / Planet Myer Day
intrax
DD-WRT User


Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 234

PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 16:49    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is i.m.o. just to intimidate alternative firmware producers and flex muscle in an attempt to look good to potential buyers/investors as it's now becoming clear that the fon concept, though in it's core being revolutionary, like it's currently being implemented is like a lame duck in the water.... it needs urgently a rethinked concept/strategy...

I think Varzavsky sees this as well and wants to cash ! Shocked
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